The Marginalization Outrage
It's time to get into a subject that somewhere along the way became unfashionable and unpopular to mention. As a conservative and an American, it astounds me that some others who call themselves conservatives and Americans have for years now---and it has been years---dismissed this topic as unimportant or passé. This may get me banned from the halls of Fox News, where rumor has it this topic is considered unmentionable.
Where is Osama Bin Laden?
Yes, the person who organized and at least partially financed the worst foreign attack on American soil ever---if we're to believe what we've been told about that. And we can, right?
The subject of Bin Laden came to mind today when I read this story about President Bush deciding to sell F-16 fighter jets to Pakistan as we try to persuade our allies not to sell weapons to China, and as we exert pressure on Iran which has an increasingly close relationship with India. Yes, Pakistan---that predominantly Islamic nation run by a nuke-wielding General who seized power from a democratically-elected leader via a military coup, and who now refuses to hold elections. Yes, Pakistan---that island of tranquility that has never experienced the slightest bit of tension with any of its neighbors. And yes, Pakistan---the nation that for years "never knew" that its top scientist essentially held an open-ended airline ticket to travel the world selling nuclear blueprints. How many more years---and via how many more weapons sales---will the U.S. continue to reward Musharraf for conceding graciously to ground A.Q. Khan? If he delivers Bin Laden ten years from now, will we send him some aircraft carriers?
But he hasn't delivered Bin Laden yet. Perhaps he's still trying to get his story straight; for two years after the U.S. invasion of Afghanistan, Musharraf maintained that Bin Laden was dead. After that was debunked by Bin Laden's video releases, Musharraf then began to lament that the trail had "gone cold" which seems to be a safe story for him now.
But Musharraf's excuses seem more credible than those coming from places you'd least expect. Bush's record of public comments on this is shameful. At a White House press conference in March 2002 he said, "He's just--he's a person who's now been marginalized. I don't know where he is. You know, I just don't spend that much time on him to be honest with you. I truly am not that concerned about him."
Can you imagine if---just a few months after 9/11---a President Gore said breezily that he "truly was not that concerned" about the person who had organized and financed the murder of thousands of American civilians? How would conservatives have reacted?
Not surprisingly, some ostensibly conservative press and think-tankers took their marching orders from Bush's comments and have been advancing the "marginalization" argument ever since. One example is James Robbins, a senior fellow at the American Foreign Policy Council and a contributor to National Review. Late last year he wrote:
Do you take comfort in the thought that even if the Bush Administration and parts of a compliant media don't care about this menace, at least those charged with keeping us safe do? Think again. Astonishingly, in January of this year, the CIA's third most senior official made the case here that Bin Laden should remain free, casually comparing him to a "venture capitalist."
What's next for the apologists and the marginalists? Advocating the release of all death-row prisoners if they promise to live quietly in the woods and not bother anyone?
Reality check: Osama Bin Laden remains the spiritual leader of Al Qaida. He is a hero to a generation of angry Arabs who eagerly snap up t-shirts imprinted with his picture on street corners throughout the Arab and non-Arab world, and his continuing freedom feeds both mythical reverence and 9/11 conspiracy theories. Since 9/11, his organization has conducted multiple attacks in countries such as Spain, Turkey, and Indonesia. If what our political and military leaders have told us is true, Al Qaida continues to attack and kill our soldiers and civilians in Iraq. Apparently feeling comfortable enough to record videos in a television studio as shown by his last on-camera statement, Bin Laden and his accomplice Ayman al-Zawahiri continue to urge attacks on our oil supplies, our economy, our soldiers, and American civilians.
This is someone who's been marginalized? This is someone who is no longer a threat? This is someone who has been able to live almost four years longer than his thousands of victims?
If you were about to jump from the 95th floor of the World Trade Center on 9/11, what would your last thought be? Next to my family, I'll tell you what mine would be: Get the bastards who did this.
How are we doing?
Where is Osama Bin Laden?
Yes, the person who organized and at least partially financed the worst foreign attack on American soil ever---if we're to believe what we've been told about that. And we can, right?
The subject of Bin Laden came to mind today when I read this story about President Bush deciding to sell F-16 fighter jets to Pakistan as we try to persuade our allies not to sell weapons to China, and as we exert pressure on Iran which has an increasingly close relationship with India. Yes, Pakistan---that predominantly Islamic nation run by a nuke-wielding General who seized power from a democratically-elected leader via a military coup, and who now refuses to hold elections. Yes, Pakistan---that island of tranquility that has never experienced the slightest bit of tension with any of its neighbors. And yes, Pakistan---the nation that for years "never knew" that its top scientist essentially held an open-ended airline ticket to travel the world selling nuclear blueprints. How many more years---and via how many more weapons sales---will the U.S. continue to reward Musharraf for conceding graciously to ground A.Q. Khan? If he delivers Bin Laden ten years from now, will we send him some aircraft carriers?
But he hasn't delivered Bin Laden yet. Perhaps he's still trying to get his story straight; for two years after the U.S. invasion of Afghanistan, Musharraf maintained that Bin Laden was dead. After that was debunked by Bin Laden's video releases, Musharraf then began to lament that the trail had "gone cold" which seems to be a safe story for him now.
But Musharraf's excuses seem more credible than those coming from places you'd least expect. Bush's record of public comments on this is shameful. At a White House press conference in March 2002 he said, "He's just--he's a person who's now been marginalized. I don't know where he is. You know, I just don't spend that much time on him to be honest with you. I truly am not that concerned about him."
Can you imagine if---just a few months after 9/11---a President Gore said breezily that he "truly was not that concerned" about the person who had organized and financed the murder of thousands of American civilians? How would conservatives have reacted?
Not surprisingly, some ostensibly conservative press and think-tankers took their marching orders from Bush's comments and have been advancing the "marginalization" argument ever since. One example is James Robbins, a senior fellow at the American Foreign Policy Council and a contributor to National Review. Late last year he wrote:
If bin Laden is alive, he has been marginalized. He probably no longer has control over al Qaida operations, if one can properly speak of al Qaida at all any more, with 75 percent of its original leadership apprehended or killed. He would have to expend most of his energy simply to survive. It is satisfying to think of him slowly losing his grip, the Norma Desmond of terrorism, denouncing the nobodies who have succeeded him as the focus of the war, retelling stories of the triumphs of his youth to his dwindling coterie, endlessly planning his comeback, rewriting his script, making ready for his close-up.Dismissive, flippant references to pop culture? Is this what "wanted dead or alive" has come to? Where is the outrage?
Do you take comfort in the thought that even if the Bush Administration and parts of a compliant media don't care about this menace, at least those charged with keeping us safe do? Think again. Astonishingly, in January of this year, the CIA's third most senior official made the case here that Bin Laden should remain free, casually comparing him to a "venture capitalist."
What's next for the apologists and the marginalists? Advocating the release of all death-row prisoners if they promise to live quietly in the woods and not bother anyone?
Reality check: Osama Bin Laden remains the spiritual leader of Al Qaida. He is a hero to a generation of angry Arabs who eagerly snap up t-shirts imprinted with his picture on street corners throughout the Arab and non-Arab world, and his continuing freedom feeds both mythical reverence and 9/11 conspiracy theories. Since 9/11, his organization has conducted multiple attacks in countries such as Spain, Turkey, and Indonesia. If what our political and military leaders have told us is true, Al Qaida continues to attack and kill our soldiers and civilians in Iraq. Apparently feeling comfortable enough to record videos in a television studio as shown by his last on-camera statement, Bin Laden and his accomplice Ayman al-Zawahiri continue to urge attacks on our oil supplies, our economy, our soldiers, and American civilians.
This is someone who's been marginalized? This is someone who is no longer a threat? This is someone who has been able to live almost four years longer than his thousands of victims?
If you were about to jump from the 95th floor of the World Trade Center on 9/11, what would your last thought be? Next to my family, I'll tell you what mine would be: Get the bastards who did this.
How are we doing?
95 Comments:
Megadittos!!!
As someone who lost friends on 9-11, all I can say is thank you.
I agree with you to a point...however, it is clear that the "war" has moved beyond the "battle" against Osama Bin Laden (that "battle" is largely won) and on to re-shaping the entire Middle East.
If given the choice between expending time and resources tracking down 2 men (Osama and Ayman al-Zawahiri) and fundamentally changing the "status quo" in the Middle East, I'll take the fundamental change in the Middle East.
Things are happening now in the Middle East that would have been unthinkable in 2000....hope is rising in places where it has been brutally suppressed for decades.
As evidenced by the collapse of Communisim, a people with hope can do incredible things...the vast majority of which are non-violent.
Would it be nice to capture/and or kill Osama? Definitely. Is capturing or killing him going to be the coup de grace that wins the "War on Terrorism?" I really don't think so.
Attempts to malign the War on Terror based upon capturing this one man seem like a partisan "tempest in a tea cup" to me.
Thank you for this!!
To Ksgregman:
Read what TCR wrote. His point is that these are not just "two men"...they are the inspirational leaders of an organization that is killing Americans RIGHT NOW and is trying to disrupt our economy on a scale equal or greater to 9-11:
"Osama Bin Laden remains the spiritual leader of Al Qaida. He is a hero to a generation of angry Arabs who eagerly snap up t-shirts imprinted with his picture on street corners throughout the Arab and non-Arab world, and his continuing freedom feeds both mythical reverence and 9/11 conspiracy theories. Since 9/11, his organization has conducted multiple attacks in countries such as Spain, Turkey, and Indonesia. If what our political and military leaders have told us is true, Al Qaida continues to attack and kill our soldiers and civilians in Iraq. Apparently feeling comfortable enough to record videos in a television studio as shown by his last on-camera statement, Bin Laden and his accomplice Ayman al-Zawahiri continue to urge attacks on our oil supplies, our economy, our soldiers, and American civilians. "
What part of that do you disagree with? Wouldn't it be more than a little "nice" to kill them???
Blog bookmarked!
It would sure be a boost to morale to 'neutralize' the guy, but should that really be a priority? Revenge becomes really expensive when it consumes you, I know that first hand. As a country we face many problems, some far more serious than getting this one man. Rest assured, he will be dealt with eventually, but if the trail has indeed "gone cold", what would you have us do? I'm just dying for some nut to scream: "Let's pull out of Iraq and go hunt Osama bin Laden!"
Would a true Conservative believe that knocking what someone whom is essentially a figurehead is a larger concern (and thus should be a larger priority) than current military operations and American policy?
Between reconstruction in a volatile nation and a need-in-a-haystack search...
I don't really think Bush is interested in protecting us, so I don't have much imput there.
But I will say that I don't think capturing Bin Laden would matter. It won't particularly alter Al Quida's functioning, people'll still buy his tee-shirts, and aside from making Bush's wet dreams a reality, it will basically accomplish nothing.
You must have missed the memo.
According to Dick Cheney and the other geniuses advising Bush, Iraq was behind 9/11. That problem has been solved. Afghanistan too.
Missions accomplished.
Now it's time to go after all of the activist judges and opponents of Bush's Tax cuts. They're Wanted, Dead or Alive!
Would people be happy if our local law enforcement starting marginalizing crimminals because it might be to hard to catch them. Why should we expect a higher standard from our local government then from the federal government. Bin laden commited a crime againist the United States and for that he should be hunted down and brought to justice not marginalized.
When Bush said he wanted bin Laden "dead or alive," we didn't realize that considered "dead of old age" to be acceptable.
Honestly, what if Bill Clinton had said, "Timothy McVeigh has been marginalized, he won't be blowing up buildings anytime soon, so we're not going to bother trying to catch him"? His impeachment would have come four years earlier.
Musharraff was forced into prominence by Nawaz Sharif's attempt to prevent his plane from landing. He is sitting on top of a huge Paki Muslim Bomb fueled by overpopulation, poverty,and jehadi enthusiasm;the fuse is a large oversurplus of testosterone. US and UK Intelligence knew all about A.Q. Khan for years - and did nothing. What is Mush supposed to do - help light the fuse ?
By the way, this might interest you:
www.cnn.com/2005/US/03/24/pentagon.binladen/
The story is about a Pentagon memo, part of a package of evidence against a terror suspect at Guantanamo Bay, which states that the suspect helped Bin Laden escape from Tora Bora. If you recall, Kerry made this a campaign issue late in the electoral season, saying that Bush did not put nearly enough military pressure in the area and let OBL go.
As for Bush apologists - Bin Laden is not just a figurehead. He quite likely is a treasure trove of intelligence on al Qaeda's plans and resources. Now, I don't think capturing Bin Laden would "end the War on Terror", which is in any case impossible by the open-ended definition of such a war, but to make the case that capturing him is insignificant ... um, yeah, whatever.
A
TCR, you better be carefull they might revoke your Conservative decoder ring over this. Although, it is good to hear someone with a Conservative slant acknowlede this in today's political climate.
In two years with over 1500 dead American soldiers, over 100 thousand dead Iraqi civilians, well over $200 billion spent, and the use of torture has returned NO weapons of mass destruction, NO Osama bin Laden, NO more security, NO peace, NO end in sight, and NO apologies. Just the way Mr. Bush seems to like it.
Very good post. The question raised in my mind is how bad does Bush really want to get Bin Laden. The evidence suggests not that bad. Not only 'not that bad', there can be a case made that attention has been diverted from Bin Laden to save him. I agree with the evidence. What battle are we really fighting, who knows. We know the selling points, we certainly don't know the facts.
God this is a good post, thanks.
While I wholeheartedly agree with the thesis of this article, the only thing that makes it unique is the source. That is to say, you don't often hear this argument made by a self-proclaimed conservative. Aside from that, there is nothing new here. This argument has been made thousands of times by non-conservatives. Indeed, the "why the hell did we quit looking for OBL?" question was raised repeatedly throughout the election campaign by those opposing Bush's reelection.
I know that when I would bring this issue up with my conservative friends and family members, I was quickly labeled anti-American. More often than not, I was accused of being brainwashed by Michael Moore since he apparently raised this issue in his movie -- a movie I never saw.
Regardless, I'm happy to see a conservative willing to question Bush's policies. On both sides of the fence we need a lot more scrutiny of policies and a lot less blind cheerleading for team.
Osama Bin Laden is more valuable to Bush while he remains free, marginalized or not. Never mind that Bush ignored warnings of Bin Laden’s plot to fly planes into buildings, or that we squandered opportunities to capture Osama in Afghanistan. Bin Laden has given Bush carte blanche to curtail our liberties at home and execute the neo-cons Middle East strategy, free from any Geneva Convention or UN interference. We’re fighting a crusade.
In the months leading up to the November elections, Dick Cheney warned repeatedly that a victory for Kerry would make us more likely to be attacked again by terrorists, while Tom Ridge raised the terror alert level to Orange. Immediately after the election (11/10), and the defeat of the terrori….er…. liberals, the color alert was reduced to Yellow. We were safe for the moment.
Now that Bush’s approval numbers are slipping, it’s time to raise the warning against terrorists, Activist Judges, defenders of Social Security and other enemies of America. Crank up the media machine, it’s a Red Alert!
bookmarked this blog and will check back frequently.
For those that think bin Laden has been marginalized and is only a figurehead without any real power I'd ask you to please think again. Do you remember 9/11? Do you really think bin Laden isn't trying to achieve something far more spectacular now? Assuming he was behind the previous attacks, and from his comments that seems likely, he seems poised to attack America again.
Don't trust me though. Some of you may have read Imperial Hubris by Michael Scheuer. He worked for the CIA for two decades until he retired last year. He served as Chief of the bin Laden Unit at the Counterterrorism Center from 96 - 99. He wrote a short article that makes the question "Where is Osama bin Laden?" of crucial importance to our safety:
Link to article
The fact that we have not captured him indicates to me that our nation's leadership is incompetent. The fact that they don't seem to care that he is still alive leads me to believe that our nation's leadership should be held accountable for any further attacks in our country orchestrated by bin Laden.
Thomas
I've never heard proof from any of you paranoids that bin Laden is more than a mascot. More than likely he's dead. I believe he's dead. If living a fugitive isn't a Muslim Terrorist Rommel.
Don't accuse me of letting my apologia be guided by loyalty rather than honesty.
Conservative apologist operandi:
1. Keep saying OBL is dead.
2. When confronted with new video that makes it clear he is alive, see #1.
3. In the event of another terrorist attack for which Bin Laden takes credit, hope and pray that people will keep listening to you as you repeat #1.
Thank you for this post....my son worked in the next street from The Twin Towers on 9/11 and, too early in his young life, got to see and hear people leap from 90th - plus floor windows.
Considering how ruthlessly vindictive the Bush crowd is towards anyone who crosses them, it's amazing that Bush is no longer bothered by Bin Laden's continued existence. I guess the neo-con Bush administration is so grateful to him - Bin Laden - for jump-starting their 19th-century-style swipe for empire..one can only wonder
Loved the post, great job. I just want to add that I see bin Laden's trail going cold and his being marginalized as incompatible. After all, if we have no leads on where he is, what he's doing, or who he's associating with, then how can we say FOR SURE that he has been marginalized. The marginalization argument sounds extremely convenient in this light. Out of sight, out of mind? I don't think so.
LOVE THIS POST!!
I think you're mistaking diplomatic language for reality. Diplomats don't speak frankly. Rather they speak in code phrases. Telling the world that we think Osama bin Laden is passe means we actually still fear him but are stating that we think our war with him is over and we won.
This post has been removed by a blog administrator.
It's all about political maneuvering.
You may recall events where the terrorist dictate the progress of a situation. Iranian student hostages? Waco? Remember the evening news starting out with "Day xxx of the crisis, . . ." Politically, this is the death of a thousand cuts; it never makes a sitting president look good. Principles be damned - Rove is much too cunning to let that happen to his boy.
Mark Browne
If Bin Laden had been captured, then a major threat that boosted Bush’s popularity would have been over with. Bush and his gang would have lost a lot of ability to manipulate the American public. Keeping Bin Laden mostly out of sight, but not out of mind gave Bush the clout he needed to win (or come close enough to winning) the 2004 election.
If you recall, Kerry and the DNC agreed with the Repubs days before the election that the newly released Bin Laden tape supported Bush for continued rule, rather than Kerry for president. People believed that Bush would keep them safer. Nevermind the fact that 9/11 happened on Bush’s watch, despite 50+ warnings. Nevermind the fact that 3 years later Bush had not found Osama ‘dead or alive’ as he promised.
The NeoCon’s carefully devised strategy has worked like a charm on the majority of America’s unsuspecting population.
You know, I see this as one of the reasons the Republicans are kicking the Democrats collective asses in the recent elections. People feel safer with the Republicans in charge right now in part because they act tough. They rarely follow up their words with deeds or planning to be tough but they certainly keep up the act. The strongest message coming from the Democrats is crying. There are no solutions coming from the Democrats. No plans saying "We are going to go kill Osama bin Laden and this is how we're going to do it." "We are going to get tough and assert our control in Iraq and Afghanistan and help the people there to live in peace and prosperity."
And that's what I see on these blogs from the left. More crying and no real solutions for a strategy. Until the Democrats get a solid message that people can stand behind the Republicans are going to continue to run the country.
Thomas
hey, the Dems had 7 YEARS (WTC I in 1993 - 1/01) to show us how THEY handle Osama and his Jihadist crowd (bombing a baby formula plant in Khartoum, Sudan and cruise missiling a deserted training camp in Khost, Afghanistan in 1998)...and they tell us that Bush did not have a plan after just 7 MONTHS in office!...they shoulda figured out in 2002 when they flubbed the mid-term elections that they have a serious credibility problem when it comes to security.
The capture of Bin Laden will be a serious blow to the Emperilists in the U.S. . 911 was used as an excuse to invade Iraq. As we all know Iraq had nothing to do with 911. However, Iraq is close enough to Saudi Arabia to encourage the Saudi's to fly a little straighter and weaken OPEC. Make no mistake this is a war for Empire not Terrorism.
Bin Laden isn't that big of a threat to us. 911 was their big attack. Acquiring bombs or chemical weapons would be very difficult for them to do on U.S soil. The activities to acquire and vector those weapons leave very evident trails. They simply don't have the means. Not even all of the 911 high jackers knew they were on a sucide mission. Suicide missions are always acts of desperation when no other means are available. The method used on 911 is now pretty much antiquated as passengers will resist any high jacker armed with a box cutter.
Bush knows that Bin Laden can really do little damage on U.S soil. The idea that Bin Laden is still out there is a much bigger asset to his agenda of Empire. As long as Bin Laden is out there we have to be wery of terrorism. Of course the "War on Terrorism" is really just a red-herring for extending an Empire into the Middle East. We can never end Terrorism through out the world. Especially when we fund terrorists in other 3rd world countries to meet our needs.
Bush had a plan for attack on Iraq within weeks of taking office. However, there was no plan for going after Bin Laden. The real question is weather Bush viewed Bin Laden as a threat or an asset. Do the ends justify the means?
KSGregman is right. What's more important is the reshaping of the Middle East. For Americans, it's about Iraq being a model of democracy. To be a model, though, it has to be seen the same way we see it. The rest of the world, however, sees more accurately that 1. the U.S. talks about democracy but seeks hegemony. In fact Al Sistanti forced the U.S. to hold elections in Iraq. 2. Iraq makeover has led to vast Al Quaida recruitment cf. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7169294/site/newsweek
3. We are too beholden to countries like Pakistan and Saudi Arabia to try to force them to become democracies.
4. The most important makeover of the Middle East would be to resolve the Palestine crisis, the engine of Muslim resentment of the U.S., but Israel gives us power in the M.E. If KSGregman believes we're making over the M.E., it's not for democracy or to avoid terrorism, it's for power and control over oil (and perhaps demonic narcissism of millenialists.) And in that, he's probably correct.
if you equate the indifference to Bin Laden's capture with Bushco's general ineptitude in " The War On Terror" (TWOT) I'd have to agree. It's a damn shame he's still running around. Speaking of TWOTs, the wingnuts around here seem especially credulous do they not? 75% of Al Queda killed or captured! (Are they working off a comprehensive master list?) Bush is TOUGH. He invades people!
I believe NOTHING this government says. NOTHING.
We are living through a period in American history worse than McCarthyism because of all the simple souls on the Right.
TCR, what do you think of the idea that the conservative movement in America (the host) has been taken over
by elite worshipping neoconservatives (parasites)
Since you're a conservative, I feel it only appropriate to ask this question: did you actually VOTE for the sorry little two-bit, tinhorn punk in the White House? And, if so, how do you justify being such an enabler?
When you so called conservatives belly up to the bar and finally admit that this country has been hijacked by a group of people who do not have your best interest in mind, you'll be heading in the right direction. George Bush and company are a band of criminals who allowed the attack on our country so that they could launch the policies of the Project for the New American Century. Evil comes to mind when I think of George W. Bush and these heartless monsters acting out their "end times" game. Dillusional republicans can either wake up or go down with the ship. This whole cabinet should be in a high security prison with no access to the outside world. They are evil and dangeous humans. Stack them all up in a nude puppy pile and slather them in their own shit. Oh, but that would be lowering ourselves to the depth of depravity of George Bush and company.
Our not-meeting-recuitment-numbers Army could use able-bodied and honest men like Arndt.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,151290,00.html
Blog bookmarked.
Gee, you voted for Shrub, and he screws over the vets and soldiers and two different countries' citizens, not to mention the working poor and middle class in the US in favor of his buds, and you're complaining about Osama bin Laden? Didn't you hear Shrub say that he didn't care about Osama and more recently that Osama's hiding, and that's why we can't find him?
You voted him back in, so quit whining. Dissent is for American-hating liberals, remember?
Quit whining. You voted him back into office.
Thanks fot the post. I am in awe in how so many consrvatives have latched on to Bush - and will follow him to hell if need be - and along with him never NEVER admit a mistake. Revisionist hypocracy they name is Republican.
WMD was the reason given to the ignorant masses in this country for pre-emptively attacking Iraq.
Al-Queda connection was the other.
Nothing about spreading freedom, nothing about remaking the middle east. While these maybe valid goals, and one can argue how to accomplish them - LYING to do it is to say the least shameful and immoral. We wanted to kick someones ass - and frankly it should have been OBL. But the assholes in power - decided to further their PNAC agenda. And if thousand upon thousands of innocents - die so be it. Screw them they are just brown people anyway. I am no pacifist, if Iraq truly had a hand in 911 - Faluja the who dammed country for all I care- but those more enlightened know that there was no such connection.
The USA is the most dominantmilitary presence in all known history. As well, our information gathering capabilities are supreme. With our military budget set at 400 billion a year, Russia is distant challenger at 40 billion a year. In fact, the entire rest of the world collectively still does not match our military might. Essentially, we are untouchable, we don't have any threats, at least threats that cannot be managed or allocated. The Pentagon is the most defended point on the planet. Our defense system, even without Bush's ludacrous missle defense plan is virtually unpenetrable. Yet the story goes that the greatest foreign attack on US soil was carried out by a couple of religous zealots planning it all out of a cave. WAKE UP AMERICA! Israeli intelligence alone is capable of tracking down any person on the planet, and has bragged and offered their services all over the world. And still Israel barely contends with our capabilities. We are the Empire, and nobody can fuck with us; unless they are allowed to. So, wheer is Bin Laden?
I have one thing to ask my fellow patriots, my countrymen. When we finally discover Cheney, Bush, Rumsfeild, Wolfowitz, and select Neo Cons as the guilty designers of 9/11, will we (1) lock them away in a civilzed prison free from torture and in accord a Just society (2) line them up and shoot them on the White House lawn, or (3) push them off the top of a skyscraper for the Nation to wittness.
Internation Banking & Big Oil is the dominant economic force of the planet. The USA, our Pentagon & State Department are the two arms of controling the planet for Banking & Big Oil. Our government is the network and lipservice for the real rulers of the world.
What difference does any of this make? We're stuck with Bush until 2009 (assuming he doesn't blow up the world before then).
The difference lies in the on going battle of telling the truth-calling a spade a sapde and neocons &this administration as the fundamentalist extremeists that they are.
Every day, every chance-tell the truth. No matter how stupid the lie they are floating at that time.
It doesn't have to be done in a cruel manner or a confrontive manner-just point out the hypocrisiy or the underlying assumpotion/demonization that is manipulating folks.
Do point out that they are being manipulated......
KSGregsman wrote:
"Things are happening now in the Middle East that would have been unthinkable in 2000....hope is rising in places where it has been brutally suppressed for decades."
That's funny. When I read actual correspondence from the Middle East, it seems that hope is dying in the places we are, and rising in the places we're demonizing. Riverbend certainly hasn't very hopeful of late, but the pro-Iranian, pro-theocracy crowd are jubilant.
Just for the record, I would like to address Thomas’ criticisms of the Democrats several posts up.
The Democrats are not crybabies. Calling them that is another Rove/Limbaugh/Republican manipulation tactic. It has unfortunately worked very well by preventing many Dems from speaking up.
Democrats lost in the two most recent presidential elections because Republicans forcefully and illegally imposed their will on Americans.
Many Republicans will say or do anything to take control—they have no scruples and believe any means is tolerable in order to dominate--- including cheating, lying, stealing, intimidating, interrupting/drowning out opposing views (FOX), arranging for conflicts of interest, denying visibility, refusing to comply with freedom of information requests, using propaganda techniques, etc. ---all in the name of VICTORY. The Republicans are the ones who are the POOR SPORTS. They cannot allow a true democratic election to take place because they realize they would LOSE the elections big-time if it were allowed to be honest.
And then when the Republican childish babies accomplish their mission undeservedly, they beat their chest and convince themselves they won legitimately, thus deceiving even themselves.
I believe the ‘weakness’ of the Democrats is that they are too civil and polite (i.e. mature) when forced to deal with the immoral, brutish competition. The Democrats should NEVER have inaccurately agreed with the Repubs that Bush would make America safer. I was aghast at such stupidity, especially since it was not true. And more importantly, the Democrats should not have pre-maturely conceded the election in an effort to avoid manipulative accusations of being called ‘whiners’.
Democrats do need to be more aggressive. They need to learn how to stand up for themselves and not be apologetic for it.
As an unabashed and proud lifetime liberal, all I can say is that you raise excellent points, to which the American people deserve answers.
Hmmmm... Why didn't Bush just try to marginalize Saddam instead of invading Iraq. DOH!!! Just think of the money we could have saved.
Osama can Run and he can Hide, and he has successfully made George Bush look like a punk. It's about time that Republicans acknowledge what us Democrats already know. That George Bush is not telling the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth. There is nothing like a reality check to stop all the spin and start doing whats right by the country and all the people, not just the "in" crowd. If and when those Republicans have had enough, they will find Democrats willing to talk things out and compromise, just like old times, bringing the country back from the hard right turn and aiming more for the middle. The biggest problem is that the Bush base has blinders on and anybody that dares to question Bush or his policies will become the target of the Rove machine, once targeted they will be demonized, and the faithful Busites will will all start chanting "kill the disbelievers" in unison. The truth, common sence, rule of law, public opinion, does not matter. All that matters is that the word from on high has been sent down and must be followed at all costs. The perfect beast will devoure it's young if need be.
To the anonymous replier:
Good response. I agree with all the points you made. At the same time I still read way too many comments on the liberal blogs (even this one) where the liberals resort to an argument that is basically "So's your mom". I see the same thing from conservatives but I feel more attached to the liberal viewpoint.
This isn't exactly right but the liberal crowd seems like my family, and when one of my family members is making an ass of themselves I feel like I need to tell them to knock it off and behave better. In large groups there are always going to be huge differences among the individuals and I've just got to relax a bit about the mudslingers, especially on the internet.
I like the style of writing of whoever it is that writes this blog. It seems like one of the better sites for recognizing the bullshit for what it is, cutting through that bullshit and discussing ideas about what we all can/should do.
Thomas
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